Adventures in E7th

[Daniel McKee]

I gave E7th a try a few months ago and its turned into a really fitting tuning for me so I am sharing my ramblings with you

https://youtu.be/TlPFMDukOW8 (part1)

https://youtu.be/csTLDsrZ8Fc (part 2 and some talk of where else you can go with E7th)

Are any of you using E7th and if so can you see it as your primary or do you keep another one handy such as C6th?

[John Chadwick]

Hi Dan,
I really appreciate the info on E7 tuning. I was playing around with it quite a bit a few years ago, and I made a post on this forum about it.

However, as much as I liked the tuning, I've backed away from it a bit because of the lack of tabs. I started playing lap steel during the pandemic after many years on guitar. Most of my playing is at home, and by myself, so in order to progress I gravitate toward all the learning material out there in C6.

I still love E7; there is something very special about the musical feeling in this tuning. And if I happen to be jamming with others in a more blues, rock, or folk context, I will sometimes tune my C6 down to E7.

But I wish there was more learning material. I did buy the Mel Bay book, but I found it too difficult to engage with. To be clear, that's on me, and my lack of formal musical knowledge. It wasn't just the lack of tab. I also need to hear the song selections that are in the book to get them in my head. Again, that's my ignorance and laziness talking. The book is high quality an I am sure many people have benefitted from it. But at age 64, I just didn't think it was worth the time investment to muddle through it.

I am looking forward to diving into your videos, particularly your options for minor chords. Thank you!

Here is a post I wrote a few years back on E7: http://mobile.steelguitarforum.com/view ... p?t=392234

And here is a link to a wonderful site with E7 licks for 8 string that are also doable on 6-string. https://www.gregcutshaw.com/E7%20Lap%20 ... uning.html

[Michael Kiese]

Very nice videos Daniel!

That E7 tuning is a lot like a C6 tuning with a low Bb, and the 6th removed.

If you do a forward slant on the bottom 3 strings, that'll get you a maj7/9 chord, which is cool.

The only thing is that tuning lacks a ready way to get minor triads without retuning. So you're stuck to chord progressions that use all major chords, which is very viable for certain genres and eras of music, but it locks you into those genres and eras of music. As soon as a minor chord shows up in a song, you're up the creek without a paddle.

Songs like Little Coquette, Caravan, Lover, etc. They're just all major and dominant chords everywhere. That kind of songwriting is idiomatic of a certain era of American music.

That said, any Dominant tuning is a good second neck tuning! There's all kinds of uses for E Dominant tunings when going V7 to I, or back door dominants.

That's usually why multi-neck straight steels more often than not, have a Major 6 tuning on one neck, and a Dominant tuning on the other. You get the best of both worlds.

[Daniel McKee]

As all have said, I do find the limitations for some songs and thats never fun right? I think what I DO like though is for a guitarist there is a lot of comfort zone diving into this tuning just because being in E is comfortable territory. Ive got more to share as I play with the tuning and thats what Im doing, just experimenting.

[Daniel McKee]

Some have asked why I said I preferred to stay in the E6th variant sometimes where I lower the D to C# and I did a quick video to show. Its kind of easier for me to grab a 7th chord from E6 rather than vice versa. My next few videos will show some more demonstrations actually in E7th where I'm tuned low to high B,D,E,G#,B,E

Im really enjoying these discussions and hope if you have experiences with E7th you will share.

Me demonstrating some capabilities when we take E7th and lower the D to C# (So technically E6th) https://youtu.be/22Yy6aSDUQw?si=zGjLf0EkrEwAV085

[Michael Kiese]

Some have asked why I said I preferred to stay in the E6th variant sometimes where I lower the D to C# and I did a quick video to show. Its kind of easier for me to grab a 7th chord from E6 rather than vice versa. My next few videos will show some more demonstrations actually in E7th where I'm tuned low to high B,D,E,G#,B,E

Im really enjoying these discussions and hope if you have experiences with E7th you will share.

Me demonstrating some capabilities when we take E7th and lower the D to C# (So technically E6th) https://youtu.be/22Yy6aSDUQw?si=zGjLf0EkrEwAV085

Hey Daniel,

Your version of E6 low to hi B, C#, E, G#, B, E is an interesting take on a major 6 tuning.

Why have the 5th in the bass? There are also two 5's (B's).

Seems to me like that orientation of notes does not offer a pleasing resolution for chord cadences on the bottom strings, which is a missed opportunity.

That said, I'm looking forward to what you can do with that tuning.

As an interesting thought, what would that tuning sound like if you used very light strings and moved every string up one octave? I wonder if that's even possible, string tension wise. You might even have to use a banjo string for that High E.

My thought process was that if all the strings were one octave higher, everything is in the upper extension range for chords. So it wouldn't matter not having a resolution on the bottom strings. You'd just rely on the bass, guitar, and/or piano to fill in the meat of the chords. The entire steel would just be for coloring chords at the high end.

At that point, the player would have to do some mental gymnastics for chord substitution, but it would make it possible for a steel with that tuning to live on the higher range of the piano, just playing all the pretty color notes way up high.

It would kinda be like a Nashville strung 6 string acoustic guitar with all the high strings of a 12 string. It might sit in the mix really well like a Nashville strung acoustic. A one trick pony, but a really great and usable trick!

That might be a cool sound and it's definitely unexplored territory!

Just my 2¢. Enjoy!

[Daniel McKee]

Ah, good observation about it definitely being an unusual take on E6, and it is. Most people dont tend to do E6 like this. For me, I actually like it, with certain songs. I like the layout for many what Id call popular songs such as "What a Wonderful World" because I tend to incorporate low and high strings into my grips for those (Just sounds nice to me). I might have to give the up tune a try you mentioned. I like to try things with various octaves so that could be a fun experiment in the very near future.

Extra note, as many notice, this tuning can be or seem a bit odd and you are absolutely correct, this is not even a typical go to version of E6 and guess what, sooner than later Im gonna show you a not even popular version of some other tunings too but coming from a lot of time with guitar, I have adapted better than I expected so I share these in case it might bridge the gap for someone else trying to learn.

[Daniel McKee]

Also to answer your question about the 2 B strings. So with this arrangement I do get some similar feeling to when I played more pedal steel as in I have the low BEG# to grab for a major chord as well. Does it serve a major purpose, nope but I had trouble eliminating it and still mentally grasping where I was at.

[Michael Kiese]

Well, if it works, then it works. Don't question it right?

Looking forward to the music you make with it!

Aloha!

[Daniel McKee]

I appreciate everyone watching and discussing this with me. Im gonna try to do another E7th video tonight. Ill post it here. You can also subscribe and get a notification when I get it uploaded if ya want.

[Allan Revich]

I often use a 6th tuning on my 7-string lap steels and found that I prefer the 6th or 7th to be on string 2. The 7th degree of a chord is typically at the top of the chord, though any inversion of a chord is generally fine. For a 6th tuning it’s a bit trickier because in a typical chord the 6th is high, but as the root note for the m7 it’s low.

The tunings I’ve tried (down a tone from E) are
D A Bb D F# A D and D A D F# A B D. The first gives a nicer version of Bm7, but the second allows you to slide up from D6 to D7 (or E6 to E7) as well as still having a decent sounding Bm7.

Nothing is carved in stone of course, and finding the tunings that work best for us is part of the fun with our instrument.